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Saturday, 10 September 2011

Currans of Boherduff and other graveyards.

The weekend before last, my brother had come over from Canada, for his usual family history visit which he doe’s annually, on one of the days we done the usual visits around some of the usual graveyards, but a couple of new ones too, we were definitely not let down either.
My Great great great grandfather Michael Curran's Grave in Dunleckney, reads 'Erected by Michael Curren of Knocklonagad in memory of his father Michael Curren who depd this life the 14th of Oct 1829 aged 69 years' (born 1760)

As well as Glasnevin, Mullhuddart, Drumphea, Kildavin, Clonegal and new from last year, Dunleckney. We also paid visits to Castledermot in county Kildare, where my Grandmother Margaret Doyle’s brother, Patrick is buried. Next up was Fennagh, Co Carlow
Church of Ireland Cemetery, there was nothing there that really took our interest, and we also visited a cemetery in Ballon, county Carlow. Finally we visited Newtown Cemetery (RC) Co Carlow, I must say that this cemetery has truly been a revelation in my genealogical searches around this area.

Andrew(right) and myself at some of the Curran graves in Newtown County Carlow.

Let me explain, it was always considered by members of my elder family that the family homestead is Drumphea, as there is a grave there with a person in it dating back to 1788 as their birth date, and an old building that has been seen as the farm that my grandfather grew up on. Though looking at the many documents around there is only one Curran family living in Drumphea in the 1850’s Griffith valuation papers, this was my GGGF Martin. But if you go 1km south of here there is a small village called Knocklonagad, where there were a number of Currans are there in the same valuation, which says to me that Martin was from Knocklonagad, as there is another brother of his definitely living down there. Yet there is no sign of Knocklonagad Currans buried in Drumphea, but there is one buried up in Dunleckney, Michael Curran. Yet still, other than a couple of other Currans in the same cemetery, this one says that Michael is from Knocklonagad, telling me that he was the father of Martin my GGGF, so he will be my GGGGF. Sorry I should have said that the Michael from Knocklonagad that is buried in Dunleckney was born around 1760, predating Martin by 28 years, is it making sense? Now upon our visit to Newtown cemetery which is about four miles from both Dunleckney and Drumphea cemeteries, we found the most Curranly numerate cemetery yet, only one in Drumphea, only one in Dunleckney, four in Newtown. The Curran’s that are buried here are now referred to by me as the Boherduff Curran’s. My new theory is that my GGGGF Michael left the family homestead in Boherduff, because there was a rather large amount of Currans in the area and probably not too much around for him, Michael moved to Knocklonagad, five miles south, this would have been around 1780, he married had a number of children, who set up various sections of farmland in the Knocklonagad area, one of these was my GGGF Martin who moved a little way across the valley to Drumphea. He then went on to have a number of children, of which one, my GGF Francis inherited his farm and so on.
The older Curran grave in Newtown reads' Erected by John Curran of Boherduff in memory of his son James who departed life june 20th 1830 aged 54 years(born 1776), alos to the memory of the above named John Curran who departed life August 27th 1841 age 90(born 1751), also his wife, Mary Curran who departed this life March 4th 1847 aged 86, also his grandson Patrick who died 14th December 1886 aged 38.  The John who is referred to here as far as i am concerned is my GGGGF Michaels older brother.
The other older grave in Newtown, Co Carlow. Read ' Erected by Thomas Curran of Boherduff in memory of his father Patrick Curran who died Dec 15th 1875(born 1783) aged 92, also his mother Mary Curran who died Dec 23 1875 aged 88 years, and his brother John Curran died Mar 7thg 1886 aged 82 years, the above named Thomas Curran died 23rd oct 1916 aged 86 years, his son John died 26th sep 1937 age 67 years, and his son Patrick died 12th jan 1942 aged 75 years, also Annie wife of john died 1st jan 1966(The Patrick that is referred to in this grave would be the son of the John in the grave in the picture above)

In the graves in Newtown some of the individuals date back to the 1750’s, which says to me that they must have been of the same birth year grouping as Michael (Knocklonagad), and because of the number of older Curran individuals buried in this graveyard, I am really glad to say that this is now the new hinterland for my Currans.
I have to offer some very big thanks to one individual for pointing me in this direction, her name is Elaine Curran, from Northern Ireland, who contacted me on one of the many forums that I have put feelers out on, and told me that her husband, Leo Curran’s descendants were from here in Boherduff, I looked up Boherduff on Google earth and low and behold, there is a cemetery in it. I had asked other Currans from the Drumphea area, as to whether or not there were any other older cemeteries in the local area from Drumphea, they told me there were not, so therefore they are unaware of this Curran grouping here in Boherduff cemetery.

We also visited the newly renovated grave in Bunclody of Peter Curran, which I must say has had an absolutely top notch job done on it. It was really nice to have Andrew, my brother over, as it always ends up that we go hunting around for new revelations to get, as well as the new finds in the cemeteries, we also met up with Richard Hoolahan, grandson of Peter Curran, my grandfathers brother. We spent a lovely afternoon with him down in Ballinteer, south Dublin. Also we had a meeting with my auntie Kathleen, her daughter Anna and son Tommy, once again two really enjoyable evenings with them, Kathleen is a fountain of knowledge when it comes to the descendants of my grandfather, martin, this time she told me of the fact that I had a cousin whose name was Frank, that I never knew of, it doesn’t matter how many times you visit a person for information regarding family history, you will always get something new from them. This is something I never actually realised until recently, but never a truer word has been noted, and if I had any advice for other amateur genealogists like myself it would be that.
After my brother leaves, because it is nearly all relating to family history, though he does come over to see the family of course, when he leaves, I am always left with a list of genealogical tasks, one thing that I really have to do is contact one part of my family that I haven’t, this is the descendants of my first cousin, Mona, who was the daughter of my uncle Frank(whom I never met, as he died before I was born) Next is to try and find the current Boherduff Currans, which won’t be a problem, and then there are a thousand and one other things to chase, watch this space..........

Friday, 24 June 2011

recent visit to london

on the weekend of june 10th, my son david and myself went to london to visit family and friends, i thought it a good opportunity to take a couple of pictures of my mum and dad to post them here. we also took a visit to where most of my brothers ashes are kept, in his mothers grave
I had a good chat with my father about pictures and he gave me a good rundown on who was who, i shall be putting all of these photos on the blog in good time.

My dad, Dermot, 94
My mother, Mary, 84
My sister Carol
My brother, Michael
All of us in my mothers flat in Battersea, thats my son David in the middle
My fathers first wife, Ivy's grave in Streatham, where martins ashes are buried also.
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Saturday, 18 June 2011

My Grandads medal


My Gradfather, Martin Curran was in the Dublin Metropolitan Police, and received this medal, so i have been told by my father and aunt, for being a personal escort to Queen Victoria during her visit to Dublin in 1900. In the Garda Siochana museum in Dublin castle, i spoke to a man there, and he said that this medal was only to commemorate the visit of the queen, and that he felt that maybe my Grandfather was just boasting to his kids, so as to make them pass on their story through the generations. I like to think it is true, because that is what I have been told all my life.

Wednesday, 8 June 2011

Hints and tips on tracing your family history

1901 census document for the Currans in Drumphea
Everybody has a different story to tell, but I can only share with you my own experience.
First thing to do is to write down everything you know about the older individuals in your family, and what you know about the deceased ones, where everyone is now, to the best of your knowledge, and potentially what they can tell you.
After doing that, then you need to speak to the individuals that you feel are important in what information they can give you.
You should treat these situations as you would an interview, firstly you must send warning that you are coming a few days in advance, so as to get the person thinking about what they can pass onto you, or to give them time to show you photographs, letters, documents and the like. It is also very important that you have any documents, records, photographs or memorabilia to hand of the family which you are discussing with them, as it will definitely jog there memory into other things, that maybe quite important. other things that would be very handy would be a laptop computer, a printer scanner, and some kind of voice recording device. The latter being very important as you can listen back a few times after to transcribe the conversation, and maybe pick up on anything you may had missed if you were scribbling into a notepad. Technology has really revolutionised genealogy.
Next you should have written out a list of questions, because if you go there and you don't do this, I can guarantee you that you will walk away and later you'll think of a question that you thought of, that you forgot to ask.
here is a list of suggested questions;
  1. What is your full name? Why did your parents select this name for you? Did you have a nickname?
  2. When and where were you born?
  3. How did your family come to live there?
  4. Were there other family members in the area? Who?
  5. What was the house (apartment, farm, etc.) like? How many rooms? Bathrooms? Did it have electricity? Indoor plumbing? Telephones?
  6. Were there any special items in the house that you remember?
  7. What is your earliest childhood memory?
  8. Describe the personalities of your family members.
  9. What kind of games did you play growing up?
  10. What was your favorite toy and why?
  11. What was your favorite thing to do for fun (movies, beach, etc.)?
  12. Did you have family chores? What were they? Which was your least favorite?
  13. Did you receive an allowance? How much? Did you save your money or spend it?
  14. What was school like for you as a child? What were your best and worst subjects? Where did you attend grade school? High school? College?
  15. What school activities and sports did you participate in?
  16. Do you remember any fads from your youth? Popular hairstyles? Clothes?
  17. Who were your childhood heroes?
  18. What were your favorite songs and music?
  19. Did you have any pets? If so, what kind and what were their names?
  20. What was your religion growing up? What church, if any, did you attend?
  21. Were you ever mentioned in a newspaper?
  22. Who were your friends when you were growing up?
  23. What world events had the most impact on you while you were growing up? Did any of them personally affect your family?
  24. Describe a typical family dinner. Did you all eat together as a family? Who did the cooking? What were your favorite foods?
  25. How were holidays (birthdays, Christmas, etc.) celebrated in your family? Did your family have special traditions?
  26. How is the world today different from what it was like when you were a child?
  27. Who was the oldest relative you remember as a child? What do you remember about them?
  28. What do you know about your family surname?
  29. Is there a naming tradition in your family, such as always giving the firstborn son the name of his paternal grandfather?
  30. What stories have come down to you about your parents? Grandparents? More distant ancestors?
  31. Are there any stories about famous or infamous relatives in your family?
  32. Have any recipes been passed down to you from family members?
  33. Are there any physical characteristics that run in your family?
  34. Are there any special heirlooms, photos, bibles or other memorabilia that have been passed down in your family?
  35. What was the full name of your spouse? Siblings? Parents?
  36. When and how did you meet your spouse? What did you do on dates?
  37. What was it like when you proposed (or were proposed to)? Where and when did it happen? How did you feel?
  38. Where and when did you get married?
  39. What memory stands out the most from your wedding day?
  40. How would you describe your spouse? What do (did) you admire most about them?
  41. What do you believe is the key to a successful marriage?
  42. How did you find out your were going to be a parent for the first time?
  43. Why did you choose your children's names?
  44. What was your proudest moment as a parent?
  45. What did your family enjoy doing together?
  46. What was your profession and how did you choose it?
  47. If you could have had any other profession what would it have been? Why wasn't it your first choice?
  48. Of all the things you learned from your parents, which do you feel was the most valuable?
  49. What accomplishments were you the most proud of?
  50. what would most like to be remembered for?
Now i'm not saying that you should use these to the book, just use the ones to suit the person. I have found that generally after 90 minutes, they will either start to go stale after to much bombardment with questions, or they just had enough of talking"shop" It is also handy to chit chat, even though you just want the info, as this breaks the interview up.
The world wide web, is a really great source for looking for all sorts of resources, you could save yourself alot of travelling time, and money, by just spending time looking for certain things.
My target families are 95% irish so Ireland is my target all the time, some of the government departments publish there records, take a look at my links page, there are plenty of sites there.
Go to the relevent archive offices, in ireland the national archives, the national library are two good ones, there are people in both these places who will help you to a certain extent, they'll get you started.
The church of the latter day saints, are dedicated to family history, for reasons of their religeon. They hold much records in their family centres,  which are found in most big cities in the western hemisphere. The one in Dublin holds lots of civil records, and some other medical and police records as well as census for 1901. They are the most helpful people I have met, and when I started out in this venture, they were the people who put me very much on the right track.
Graveyards are very good too, if you can get to the relevent one that is great, but if you can't, sometimes there are lists on the web, and pictures of the graves too. There was a great aunt that i was told of, who went to america, but no one really knew anymore than that. I put her name on google as well as graves and USA, and guess what? Yep, there she was on a grave list! so then I contacted the local historical society in that place, and for a small fee, they done a local search, and i got a bundle of information on her and her family.
Local parish offices are worth a try, for more recent BMD's that may have taken place in their church. Most larger graveyards would have an office, which you could ask where your relative is.
No matter what anyone tells you or what you read on the web, it is not an easy downhill slide, and can be very sticky at times, In the couple of years doing my own family, which I have still a long way to go, it has been an uphill slog, and it doe's not come to you, you have to go out and ask. I wish you luck, and if i can ever offer any help or advice just drop me a line at

Handy links

We all know that there are a million and five different places to go if you want to start looking into your irish roots, from my own experience, here is a selection of my faves.
This is  genealogy nirvana, the latter day saints church, have created a search database of god knows how many different countries, in all sorts of civil and parish sources. In relation to Ireland, it will give you a cross reference that you can look up relevant details for civil births, deaths and marriages, going back to 1864 for catholic records and 1845 for church of ireland. Have a go, look up your granny, I bet she's there!
The irish genealogy project, though some counties included in this, i must say are a little sparce on the info front, some are just an absolute gorge for a genealogical beast like myself. If you've got an interest in Carlow like me, you will see what i mean. these people must eat ,sleep and do whatever with the past on there mind. many a question has been answered on this one for me, and will continue to be i'm sure!
Up to september 2009 these lovely people from the national archive in dublin had the dublin county for the 1911 census available on the web, but now whoopee! it has gone NATIONAL!! Oh! happy day. It was amazing the amount of people I pulled from this is just outstanding. If your from across the way in uk or north america or oz, this is a good one to see where the family name stayed, when your ancestors done a runner from the famine, or poverty, or were just shipped out cos they were bad. You can find out where they came from, by seeing the family that remained until 1911 at least. Just a short footnote to this one, those wonderful people down the national archive now have the complete 1901 census online too! We can also look forward in the near future also to the 1926 census being made available too. It just doesn't get better than this, I have to say that this must be a definite first place to visit, when looking up your irish family history online
*****(5 stars) for this site
From where I am standing, which is very easily corrected by the way. Griffiths valuation was a survey of the heads of family, their landlords, the amount of land they had, how much it was worth, and the rent they paid. This was done in the mid 1800's, I know in Carlow it was 1854/5. So this may give you as it gave me a positive indicator of my great grandparents location, and told me about those bad british landlords, who just milked whatever shillings out of my poor ancestors, so they could get fatter. But also a great source for post famine genealogy.
As well as how to fix the washing machine, or how to make lassie do the latest trick, or how to tell a good joke, google has proved to be probably another hub of genealogical eden. You put in parish records ballyblahblah, county whatever, and chances are you'll get what you are looking for, and probably more. I found positive birth dates for grandparents, and so on.  but then would always end up looking for the best game of tetris online when i couldn't find something.
A list of graves in cemeteries around the world, whilst doing my genealogy, I met a man, who would go around cemeteries on the northside of dublin and take photographs of every grave he comes to, then he would email them to these people who would then transcribe them and then you have it. I found an absolute corker on this site, I was told of a great aunt who just upped and left to live in wisconsin, so I googled her and there she was, with all her family in Yuma, Wisconsin. Unbelievable.
Good news on this one, I was down in Glasnevin the other day, trying to find out about my ancestors, and the nice man behind the counter at reception, said that this site will be publishing a cross referencable database in april 2010, similar to the irish census records of 1911, as he put it. it means that now I don't have to go to them every month, and that you, maybe across the oceans will now now who where and when your ancestors are buried in Irelands biggest cemetery.
Though most things on this site you have to pay for, and you can see most of them for free on family search.org, the forums on here are great, but only if your from nth america/ oz etc, because they all talk of their GGGgrandmother, who was from so and so and her and the kavnaugh boys went over to oklahoma. good reading, though as well as that there are alot of free parish lists which are a brilliant source.
like ancestry but smaller.
forum wise i struck gold on this one, there are a bunch of family history heads on here, who are busting to see who comes in the door with there enquiry, and will go mad to help you, I have seen nothing but people thanking one another for the help and just wanting to please, after being put on a good sniff of a lead, by one of there fanatically helpful members, I got the bug and started joing in myself, this is a really helpful thing to do, because you can brush up on your own genealogical skills looking up for other people so you can dig yourself out of your own genealogical holes!!
I paid €10 to join this site, and there is alot going on, but absolutely nothing came of it, they ask you to put in a family tree, I put in 200 of mine, and then they potentially link up two that are the same, saying that you have a match like a pair of cards, for instance, say aunt bessie was born in 1900 and then angus mcfergus up in aberdeen has an aunt bessie too, born in 1900 they will give you the chance to contact angus. I have contacted hundreds of people on this site, and wasted much time trying to get my €10 worth, but i'm sorry to say, not a thing. though I am not slagging them, i'm sure another person will tell you they found there long lost brother or something.

Curran family documents(with a little bit of background)#1

Here is a list of some documents I have in relation to my family history, census records, marriage certs, birth certs etc. Also I will add some footnotes about what sort of background i know of the situation looking at them.
Martin Curran(B1862) Marriage cert
Just three days earlier, on the 27th april, the summer Olympics had started in London, and the day after the nazi, Oskar Schindler, who was described as 'The Unforgettable Lifesaver of 1200 Persecuted Jews' was born.
Fairview church is found in the northeastern end of Dublin city, nestling on the banks of the River Tolka. Five years earlier my Grandfather, martin Curran had lost his first wife margaret Gaul, from Knocksquire, County Carlow. He had three surviving children from this marriage. These were Mary(11years) Sarah(9years) and frank(10years), these are the ages they were in 1908. Margaret Doyle, my grandmother had known martin previously, and was a minder of Martins children. At the time martin was living in the family home in richmond avenue, fairview, and Margaret Doyle resided in Russell terrace in Church Road, Eastwall. Margaret lived with
Alfred and Sarah Spellman of Russell Terrace. Alfred(39 at the time), who was born in Australia, was a carriers clerk, and reputedly owned a pub in Henry street in Dublin city. Sarah was the female witness at the wedding, she was 35 years old at the time, and was born in County Wicklow. My aunt kathleen Curran remembers this couple as being close friends of Margaret, her mother. At that time they had been married for 16 years, and had no children.  Kathleen also noted that her brother Alfred(my uncle) was named after this gentleman.
William Flynn, was the male witness at the wedding, he was a barber, and ran his business in fairview strand, where he also lived, He married mary in 1908, begging the question were martin and william married on the same day. William and his wife mary were both 24 years of age at the time.
The priest that married, my grandparents was, Denis Pettit, who was 56 years old and from Granard, County Longford.
There are alot of theories shooting around about the wedding, and many questions to answer, Martin was 45 on his wedding day, and William Flynn was only 24. Would it have been a fact that William was marrying in the church on the same day, and martin got him because he had no male witness? Or were they genuinely friends? Time will tell, as I will checkout William and Marys wedding date.

16 june 2011
Just a small update on this, i did check up on william flynns marriage date and it was the 20/7/1908, so he was not married on the same day. though 26 fairview strand is quite literally opposite the church, and maybe it was the case that martin 'nabbed' him. maybe he knew him, maybe he didn't. we will never know.

Tuesday, 7 June 2011

Curran gravestones in Drumphea, County Carlow

 There are two gravestones, right in the backwoods of southeastern carlow, in a quaint little village called
Drumphea, this how they read;
My grandfather, Martin Curran, seemed like myself to have a very strong connection with his ancestors, he raised this grave in memory of his father and also all of those in the grave, but also, there is one thing to note, and it is important, that not necarsarily are all the people mentioned on the stones are actually interred beneath them, there are at least three of them, firstly Martin Curran DMP himself, he lived and died up in Dublin and is buried in Glasnevin cemetery. second on the list is Peter Curran, who is buried with his family in Bunclody, just a few miles from Drumphea. Then thirdly is Catherine Curran, who is buried with her family in St Patricks cemetery in Vernon county, Wisconsin, USA. Upon seeing these graves in this light, it would be quite safe to say that these gravestones, one of which was erected by Martin DMP was more of a tribute to his Carlow family, rather than just a normal record of who lies below. A kind of genealogical list for future Currans to visit and admire.
The great thing about these graves is that they immediately transport us back to around 1788, when my Great Great Grandfather, Martin Curran was born(according to the stone) and his wife anne who was born a year later.
Though I cannot say 100%, that alot of the dates and ages mentioned on the stone do not nessarsarily add up. I will give all the examples i know at present(11/09)
Nannie Curran died 4/12/1884 age 24 years, I have seen her christening record as 30/1/1857 as anne, she would have actually been just two months short of her 28th birthday.
Mary Curran died 27th april 1889 age 27 years, once again, I have seen her baptismal cert on 4 nov 1858 which would have made her 30 years old.
Patrick Curran died 4 april 1889 age 17 years, again I have seen his civil birth certificate for 27 feb 1870 so he would've be over 19 years.
Peter curran died 11 may 1929 age 56. Peter is buried over in the old cemetery in bunclody, on that grave it states that he died in 1928, he was born 1 feb 1872, according to the civil record of his birth. It would be correct in bunclody but he should be 57 on the drumphea grave.
Bridget Curran died jan 12 1963 age 85, I have seen her civil record, and she was born 14 may 1875, 4 months short of her 88th birthday.
There are a couple of reasons this may have  happenned. Firstly when Martin was erecting the first grave he may have had record of the dates of death, and may have gone by his memory, as to how old they were when they died, I was told by my father that Martin DMP was quite old when that grave was raised. The next, and most probable explanation, was the fact that back in those days, people just didn't celebrate their birthdays like what we do nowadays, your birthday would just come and go, without you being aware of it, and then as time went on, birthdays came more fashionable, and then these people may have speculated their age, usually giving it a couple of years younger than they actually were. I have seen it elsewhere in my ancestry.
I know for a fact that  James and Sarah are definitely correct. As for the rest, I don't know.
There is a third Curran grave in Drumphea just a few yards away from these two.  I have recently spoken to a second cousin, who has informed me that it is of her father James Curran, who was the son of Francis Curran.